Libro.fm Podcast – Episode 37: “Interview with Natalie Naudus”

On today’s episode, we chat with prolific and beloved audiobook narrator, Natalie Naudus, who shares her journey into the world of audiobooks. We discuss the challenges and rewards of the profession, including the process of bringing characters to life through voice. The episode provides an insider’s look at the audiobook industry, and we discuss tips and tricks of the trade, how AI narration is disrupting the industry, her debut novel, and much more.

---

About our guest

---

Audiobooks by Natalie Naudus

---

Audiobooks we discussed

---

Full transcription

Music:

Libro.fm Podcast with Craig and Karen supporting.

Local bookstores out of your books and more.

Join the world of stories.

As always, thank you for listening.

Karen Farmer:

Hello and welcome to the Libro.fm Podcast where we talk to authors, narrators, booksellers, and more. I’m Karen.

Craig Silva:

And I’m Craig. On today’s episode, we got to interview Natalie Naudus, who if you are an audiobook fan, which I imagine you are if you’re listening to this podcast, should ring some bells.

Karen Farmer:

Yes, Natalie is an absolute legend in the audiobook world. She has narrated so many beloved favorites. You may have heard of One Last Stop by Casey McQuiston, Natalie narrated that. Also won a very major award for it. And what you’ll learn in today’s episode, if you didn’t know already, is that Natalie has now written a book as well.

Craig Silva:

So, so, so talented. The book came out on June 4th, 2024. So if you’re listening to this right now, you should go buy it at your local bookstore. It’s called Gay the Pray Away.

Karen Farmer:

It is, and it’s absolutely fantastic. I really enjoyed it. And of course, Natalie narrated it herself. Who else?

Craig Silva:

Can you imagine if she didn’t? I think I asked that. I was like, “Did you ever consider not narrating it?”

And she was like, “No.”

I was like, “Well, moving on.”

Karen Farmer:

Yeah, I think this is a really interesting interview too because we learned that there are some parallels between the content of Gay the Pray Away and Natalie’s life. So it’s a really, really important book for her on a lot of levels, and I can’t wait for all of you to learn more about that too.

Craig Silva:

Yes. I will play a clip from the book so you can hear Natalie and Gay the Pray Away. And then we’ll roll the interview. And unlike our last three episodes, this time, you can stick around at the end and Karen and I will talk about what we are reading and enjoying right now.

Karen Farmer:

Perfect.

Natalie Naudus:

“Are you okay? Should I come in?”

I’m standing outside the open bathroom door, unsure of what to do. Should I go in and hold her hair? Is that a thing? But her hair is pretty short, isn’t it? She sounds so miserable. Riley wretches again, and then I hear the toilet flush and the sink run.

“Riley?” I appear into the bathroom.

Riley comes out, her face pale and sweaty. She crawls into bed and I bring her the empty ice bucket just in case, and a cold wet washcloth.

“Can I get you anything else?”

“No.”

“I’m so sorry, Riley.”

“I’ll be okay. Just dying a little.”

“Was it the chicken?”

“I don’t know. If it was, why aren’t you sick too?”

“I don’t know. I did go to Taiwan a few years ago to see relatives and I was stupid and drank some tap water and got really sick, but I haven’t thrown up since then, so maybe I’m stronger from it.”

“I don’t think it works like that.”

“I don’t know. Maybe it does.”

I lie down in the bed beside her. Then I sit up, snatch the room phone from its cradle and dial my parents’ room.

“Hello?” Mom answers.

“Hi, mom. Riley is sick.”

“Oh, no. What happened?”

“I don’t know. She said she didn’t feel well and just started throwing up.” I glance at Riley, she’s curled around a pillow. Eyes squeezed shut.

“How are you feeling? Are you sick too?” Mom says.

“I’m okay right now, but if it’s a stomach bug, I’ll probably get it too, won’t I?”

“I’ll send your dad to the vending machine for some Gatorade. What flavor does she prefer?”

“Let me ask her.” I turned to Riley.

“What flavor of Gatorade do you like?”

“Blue.” Riley says so, so sadly.

“She says blue mom.”

“All right, I’ll have dad leave it at your door. Let her know we’re praying for her. Check in with me in the morning and let me know how you both are doing.”

“Okay, thanks mom.”

I replace the phone and glance at Riley again. She still curled up in a ball, bedding crumpled at her feet. I carefully pull the sheet and blanket up, tucking them gently around her.

“Thanks, Val.” She says miserably.

“You going to make it?” I place my hand on her shoulder and stroke her arm. My fingers itch to move a curl from her forehead, but I stop myself.

“I think I’ll live,” Riley [inaudible 00:04:39].

I try not to think about how very sad and still somehow very cute she is. A knock sounds at the door. That’ll be my dad.

Karen Farmer:

Hello everyone. We are here today with Natalie Naudus, who is a renowned narrator and an author with a first book coming out soon. Welcome to the podcast, Natalie.

Natalie Naudus:

Thanks, Karen.

Karen Farmer:

I would love for you to take a moment to introduce yourself in your own words to our listeners and just share a little bit about what all you have been up to in the world of books.

Natalie Naudus:

Yeah. I’m Natalie Naudus. I’m a pretty well-known audiobook narrator at this point I would say. I’ve recorded over 500 books and I mostly record queer fiction of all kinds and this is my debut novel.

Karen Farmer:

We are very excited to talk to you about this. We are huge fans of your work and so excited that you have a book coming out.

Natalie Naudus:

Thank you.

Craig Silva:

Yes. You kind of just read right off my script. So I was about to say you’re a prolific narrator, but you have some big news. You have your own book coming out in June. So for our listeners, can you tell us what it’s about and why we should all be excited about it?

Natalie Naudus:

Yeah, I kind of timed it with Pride Month on Purpose. It’s called Gay the Pray Away. Some people are like, “What?” But it’s swapped. It’s not Pray the Gay Away, it’s Gay the Pray Away. And it’s a YA Romance about a girl who realizes that she is in a Christian homeschooling cult and starts to process that and falls in love with a girl and ends up running away. So it is a romance, but it’s also I would say a love letter to queer fiction and religious deconstruction and self-discovery.

Craig Silva:

So you mentioned that you’ve narrated 500 books, which is crazy. Most people don’t read 500 books, let alone narrate them. What was the experience of narrating your own book compared to other people’s work?

Natalie Naudus:

It was easy and hard at the same time. It was easy because I’m so familiar with the material. I wrote it, I went through so many rounds of edits with it. Sometimes I have to stop when I’m recording because I’m not sure where the sentence is going, because somebody else’s brain. But for my own book, that was pretty easy. But it was hard because the subject matter is so personal to me and really came from my own heart and trauma. So I definitely had to take breaks and cry and pet cats and get through it.

Craig Silva:

I really love the introduction you included at the beginning, talking about why writing this book was so important to you. And you kind of alluded to it just a minute ago, but can you share for our listeners what that was like?

Natalie Naudus:

Yeah, so I actually myself grew up in a Christian homeschooling cult and I didn’t really realize it until I was an adult. I was talking to some friends about, “Yeah, we all burned CDs and Satanic toys back in the day, right?”

And they were like, “No, we didn’t.”

And I went and looked at my homeschooling program, which I knew was kind of cult-ish and not the way that I was living now, but it was a [inaudible 00:08:03] cult. It was the cult that the Duggars were in. There was a documentary, Shiny Happy People that’s out. That was the cult that I was in. As I was deconstructing that, I started writing a ragey memoir of sorts and I realized it was too hard. I would never publish that. It’s hard to know whose names you’re going to include, who you’re going to call out. It was too hard. So I wrote this book, which is fiction. The plot did not happen to me, but the setting is something that I’m very familiar with. And the thoughts of going through discovering that you are queer and having that baggage of so much religious suppression and working through that.

Karen Farmer:

To take this in a little bit of a different direction, I love what you’re saying about these journeys of self-discovery that are important to the character in your book. And something that I learned about you for the first time really recently is that you actually started out as an opera singer and I think that’s so cool. Can you tell us a little bit more about that journey from opera to full-time audiobook narrator and author?

Natalie Naudus:

Yeah. I got my undergrad and my master’s degree in opera and vocal performance. And I tried really hard to make it work. There is a lot more singers than there are jobs, for sure. I mean, most universities that have a music department have a vocal program. So they’re churning out all of these opera singers and there’s really not that many opera houses in the states anymore. And so I was working really hard, doing a lot of auditions. I was traveling a lot for rehearsals for kind of C-level shows that I was in. And I was listening to audiobooks all the time, feeling really disillusioned with what I’d studied and what I was doing with my life. And then I just looked up, how do people become audiobook narrators? And I realized that things had changed a lot, that people were recording from home very much.

The internet was very much our friend here and I got on ACX and just started doing it and I started going to events, meeting producers, and it was so fulfilling and I was landing work that actually paid. It felt like finally I found a job in the arts that was loving me back, whereas opera just never did. So I was really happy to make the switch and I honestly don’t miss that kind of toxic relationship I had with opera where I just never felt good enough, was never really making money or… I was teaching more than I was getting paid to perform. Anyways, so it was a great switch and it actually, I feel like prepared me super well for audiobook narration with all of the vocal flexibility and text analysis and being able to sing a three-hour opera sitting in my booth, reading all day is not a strain. So I feel like it has been a perfect fit for me.

Karen Farmer:

Oh, I love that so much. I was really curious if the opera training and the work you had done there carried over in an interesting way. Because I’m like, technically it’s the same instrument that you’re using and you’ve been using your whole life just in early different way. How do you take care of your voice? How do you make sure that this instrument can keep performing every day?

Natalie Naudus:

I definitely hydrate. I usually sleep with a humidifier to keep things moist and working in good order. I don’t smoke. I try not to yell too much, but besides that, a lot of it’s more taking care of my body and making sure that I’m stretching and exercising because the recording is so grueling on the body. It’s like I’m taking a flight every day, I have to sit so still. So a lot of it is keeping moving and taking care of myself holistically.

Karen Farmer:

That makes so much sense. You might have just answered my question, but when you started narration and got into this world, was there anything that surprised you about it that wasn’t what you were expecting?

Natalie Naudus:

I think the biggest thing is that because books are so long, we don’t get to rehearse them. Everything else that I’d been a part of, we were memorizing our parts and we were rehearsing and practicing and analyzing and trying each little nuance, each little thing in different ways. Whereas with books, we have to essentially read cold. I do prep, but I don’t read the whole thing out loud every time. There’s no way that I could make a sustainable living doing this if I did that. So it takes a really quick thinking mind to be able to keep looking at the page and think what’s the best way to spin this and hopefully get it in the first take. Because I don’t have time to go back and redo every sentence that I’m doing. So it’s a lot like extreme cold reading all day, every day.

Craig Silva:

That is so interesting.

Karen Farmer:

That is fascinating.

Craig Silva:

You sort of alluded to this when you said you kind of got into the sector and you started going to events and ever since reading Julia Whelan’s Thank You for Listening. I’ve been intrigued by this narrator’s insider circle world, where there’s the Audie Awards obviously, but we saw on Instagram, you even went to a narrator’s retreat and I was curious if you could just give us a little peek behind the curtain of what this community looks like.

Natalie Naudus:

I find that book people are generally just really lovely people and we’re not usually tremendous extroverts. We’re a little quiet and nerdy and I think that makes for great people to hang out with. And some of my best friends have come from the narrator community. I would say most of my friends that I talk to on a daily basis, they’re all narrators at this point. It’s great to have a huge thing that we love books in common and it leads to having a lot of other things in common too.

Craig Silva:

Oh, that’s awesome. And I completely agree, Karen and I get to go to a bunch of book conferences every year and book people are the best, for sure. We’ve met so many nice people.

Natalie Naudus:

Yeah. Absolutely.

Craig Silva:

So speaking of these communities, and this is maybe a slightly touchy subject, but I’m curious, with all the AI narration happening right now, what are these conversations looking like with all your narrator friends? I assume you guys must be talking about this.

Natalie Naudus:

Yeah, there’s a lot of concern for sure. And it feels like it’s kind of coinciding with the backlist that felt infinite kind of drying up. A lot of people had full-time work from recording backlist titles that hadn’t been made into audiobooks yet. And so that’s kind of running out as we’re worried about AI taking over a lot of that backlist. So there’s definitely concern. I’ve seen people leave the industry. I’ve seen people pivot. I’m really lucky that I mostly record simultaneous releases, stuff that’s coming up. So I haven’t seen a hit in my work yet, and I really hope that the front list stuff still goes to human voices and I think it will. I think that if a project is something that people really care about, it’s still going to be going to human voices for a long time at least. I hope so. I’m okay for now, but there’s definitely concern in the industry for sure.

Craig Silva:

That’s really interesting about the backlist. I didn’t really think about that. Where if you want to do a book that’s 20 years old and you’re probably not going to sell a ton of them that they’re… Yeah.

Natalie Naudus:

That’s the stuff that’s going to AI first.

Craig Silva:

Yeah.

Karen Farmer:

Interesting.

I really love your bio on your website, and I wanted to share this right now, actually, given this conversation. You write that you relish the emotional journey through the book, finding a unique and honest voice for each character and doing your utmost to honor the words of the author. And I really love that because it just makes it so clear how important this work is and how artistic it is. And I wondered if you could share a little bit about that prep or that you mentioned a moment ago. When you’re getting ready to record something, how do you familiarize yourself with the book and characters and make choices around what these people will sound like?

Natalie Naudus:

Yeah. First I just read the book quietly, not out loud, and I make a list of the characters and things that are said about them, about their appearance or their personality or the way that they talk. I don’t necessarily plan out each voice before I record, but I feel like that gives me a sense of who they are and what I’m going to do. And then there’s another consideration, which is how much they talk. Because sometimes there’s an old man, I’ll think, oh, I can give him this great old man voice. But if he talks a ton, like pages long of backstory or giving speeches or whatever, that’s going to hurt my voice eventually. So I have to kind of take into consideration a lot of different factors about how much they’re talking, who else they’re talking with.

Are there six old men that I have to be able to differentiate between? And do they talk to each other a lot? Things like that. So that’s what the prep read helps me get down. And also an idea usually for the main character about kind of the character arc that they go through. And that was something that I felt like was so easy when I recorded my own book that I was able to start so tentative and scared honestly and kind of infuse it with an arc, with a growing awareness, growing self-confidence, growing acceptance of self as it goes on.

Karen Farmer:

These examples are so fascinating to me. And thinking about the old man voice example in the dependency of how much does this person actually talk, have you ever been in a situation where you’ve had to change your approach to a character or a voice midway through the project and what do you do?

Natalie Naudus:

I’ve definitely gotten into a project and been like, oh, I made a poor choice here. Maybe it’s just allergy season or maybe I find out there’s a sequel and someone who I thought didn’t talk much is the main character in the next book. If it’s the same book and I know I made a terrible mistake, I’ll go back and rerecord their lines and drop them in. If it’s the next book and the first book was already published and surprise, the Wizard talks a ton in this book, I will just modify his book and kind of cheat it towards what’s easier on my voice so that I don’t hurt myself.

Karen Farmer:

Got you. Okay, cool. I’m so intrigued by this.

Craig Silva:

You mentioned the old man voice being tough. I know it was just an example, but are there any characters that when you open the book for the first time for a new project, you go like, “Oh, no, not this kind of voice.” Is there any… What’s on the list you’re not happy to see?

Natalie Naudus:

Early in my career I recorded a lot of Reverse Harem and those were hard. Because every time, it’s like you got four, five guys who are all 6’4″, all have low rumbly voices, all are macho men. So figuring out how to distinguish between them was always a challenge. I was always like, all right, who can we give a British accent to because we got to find a way?

Craig Silva:

That’s funny. Ever since I started at Libro, I have friends being like, I want to get into narration. Do you have any? And I’m like, I designed the app. I don’t know anything about narration. So for my friends and other people that might be listening, do you have any tips for… I know you said you just looked it up, but do you have any tips for people? I’m sure you must get asked this by folks, but…

Natalie Naudus:

Yeah, the main thing is to have really strong acting skills and really fast text analysis, for sure. A lot of people say, “Oh, I’ve always been told I have a great voice. How do I get into audiobooks?” But it’s so much more than having a nice voice and in fact, having a unique quirky sounding voice can be a great career. I mean, we have actors who do children’s books and cartoon voices and there is a place for every kind of voice. What really is the most important thing is your own acting skills and your ability to turn text into performance.

Craig Silva:

That’s super interesting and I feel like we’ve talked to a few narrators when we were researching, looking at their website. A lot of them do also act in addition to narrating, so that makes total sense.

Natalie Naudus:

Yeah, it’s really an acting job.

Karen Farmer:

I wanted to shout out your super cool Patreon. I wanted to make sure that we told people about this. I understand that you’re working with M.H., Gallucci, I hope I said that right. To write and produce sapphic erotic short stories. So what can you share with us about that work?

Natalie Naudus:

Yeah, thanks for bringing that up. I write along with my girlfriend stories that are all spicy and all sapphic and we release one every month on my Patreon. And it’s just a cool way for people to support sapphic stories and then we’re going to bundle them together and release them as short story anthologies. I’m in a lot of sapphic fiction groups and I always saw people be like…

I’m in a lot of sapphic fiction groups and I always saw people say, “What’s the spiciest read that you have? What’s definitely spice in every chapter?” And that’s not a normal book trajectory. Romance will have a spicy scene, so we are taking it upon ourselves to fill that gap.

Karen Farmer:

Yes. Well, thank you for your work, all spice, all the time. I love it. So we have a kind of silly portion of the podcast now that we call the Lightning Round where we have gathered some very short, rapid fire questions for you that you don’t need to think about them too much, it’s just to learn a little bit more about you. And I think Craig has the first one.

Craig Silva:

I wrote this question before I realized you’ve narrated 500 books, so I have no idea if you even read for pleasure or if you even have the time. But what book is your go-to reread for comfort? Like a comfort book?

Natalie Naudus:

Sputnik Sweetheart, Haruki Murakami.

Craig Silva:

You had that ready?

Natalie Naudus:

Yeah.

Craig Silva:

Yeah.

Karen Farmer:

Who is your favorite character you’ve ever gotten to voice and why?

Natalie Naudus:

Oh, that’s a hard one. There was this character in a series by Deborah Wolf and her name was Hafsa Azeina, I think. And I gave her this really hoarse badass old lady voice, and I use it all the time. And I write the character’s name, Hafsa Azeina, down when I… To bookmark that in whatever book I’m recording. So I would say she’s probably my favorite. She comes up a lot.

Karen Farmer:

That was very cool to hear and see.

Craig Silva:

I was actually wondering about that earlier. I was like with narrating so many characters, when a sequel comes up, you must have to go back and listen. How did I voice this character? Or apparently you can just pull it out of your head very easily, but…

Natalie Naudus:

I have a lot of lists for sure, and I’ll save samples too. But mostly at this point I can write myself a little shortcut and it makes sense to me, but wouldn’t make sense to anyone else.

Craig Silva:

That’s interesting. I’ve heard from other narrators that there’s tricks for being able to talk for multiple hours. Someone told us they eat an apple. I was curious, do you have any special tricks that work for you?

Natalie Naudus:

No, I think it’s just the opera training, honestly.

Karen Farmer:

I did a little e-stalking and I see that you are a fellow crocheter and I am curious, what’s the coolest thing you’ve ever crocheted?

Natalie Naudus:

All I’ve made are blankets, but they’re really fun because I’m making them for my kids and my sisters and everyone is special to each child or adult sister. So I guess that special personalized blankets in colors people are picking out.

Craig Silva:

What is a memorable mistake that you’ve made while recording?

Natalie Naudus:

I remember saying reindeer instead of deer one time and it was close to Christmas, so I think it was just on my mind.

Karen Farmer:

I like that, you’re like, there’s a plot twist in this book now.

Craig Silva:

Do accidents like that ever make it into the final recording? You didn’t realize you said it and then you ship the files off and then someone’s like, why was there a reindeer in chapter eight?

Natalie Naudus:

Yes, it does happen. And sometimes we’ll get emails and we’ll be like, shoot. The proofer didn’t catch it. I missed it. The editor didn’t catch it.

Craig Silva:

Oh, man.

Karen Farmer:

My last question for you is would you rather. Would you narrate a book with 50 different characters or with one character?

Natalie Naudus:

50 for sure.

Karen Farmer:

Really?

Craig Silva:

Why is that?

Karen Farmer:

… Tell us more.

Craig Silva:

Yeah.

Natalie Naudus:

Just keeps me engaged, switching voices. Only one character the whole time. I don’t know, it depends on how good the writing is, I guess.

Karen Farmer:

Awesome.

Craig Silva:

So you’ve made it through lightning round. Our last thing before we pester you for book recommendations is Instagram story time where we stalk your Instagram and choose a photo to get more information about.

Natalie Naudus:

Okay.

Karen Farmer:

So the photo that I found to ask you about is from January 26th, 2023, and you are outside with a really cool looking machine and a bunch of solar panels, and it sounds like this is for recording. And you say you’re in an idyllic mountain on an idyllic mountain. Can you tell us more about this setup and this awesome solar machine?

Natalie Naudus:

Yeah, it’s a power bank, which is charged by solar. So when I lose power, I can switch over to solar and keep working for the afternoon.

Karen Farmer:

Oh, very cool. And is that where you are right now in the space you’re in today?

Natalie Naudus:

Yeah, I’m in the shed and we do lose power up here pretty frequently, so being able to switch to a backup is great.

Karen Farmer:

That’s very cool. Good to know. Just

Natalie Naudus:

Just imagine-

Karen Farmer:

Way back.

Yes, we did our homework. I just can’t imagine the horror of being in the middle of a recording or something. Then everything shuts off. That seems traumatizing.

Natalie Naudus:

It happens more often than you would think.

Karen Farmer:

I’m so sorry. Awesome. Well, I think that kind of brings us to the end of our meatiest questions for you. But before we let you go, we would be remiss if we didn’t ask if you have any book recommendations for us, anything you’ve recently read and enjoyed that you would like to tell other people to go read.

Natalie Naudus:

I really, really enjoyed Interesting Facts about Space by Emily Austin. I just found it so interesting and thoughtful and unusual. I loved it.

Karen Farmer:

I’m so excited.

Natalie Naudus:

The description… There’s no way to really explain. She has a fear of bald men. She calls her mom and gives her interesting facts about space. It’s just one of those books that I’m not sure if what’s happening is important, but how we’re getting there is very interesting. The other book I would really recommend is Grey Dog by Elliott Gish, one of the best books I’ve ever read. It’s such a slow burn horror novel and I just hope people read it because it’s a slow start, but it builds and builds to this crazy conclusion that was so satisfying to record and I can’t recommend it enough.

Craig Silva:

So, so sold.

Karen Farmer:

Thank you so much.

Craig Silva:

Yeah.

Karen Farmer:

Yes. I’m going to go get both of these.

Craig Silva:

You had me at horror, so that is it. Thank you so much for making the time and I’m sure you have a million things going on, so we really appreciate you sitting down with us.

Natalie Naudus:

Thank you for having me. I had a great time talking to you.

Craig Silva:

Awesome.

Karen Farmer:

Thanks, Natalie.

We are so excited you could join us for that interview with Natalie. I hope you learned as many mind-blowing things as I know I did, and I think Craig did as well. I guess before we head out, we would like to talk a little bit about what we are reading and enjoying. And Craig, I would like for you to go first this time.

Craig Silva:

Me to go first. I’ve been bamboozled.

Karen Farmer:

I hope you’re ready.

Craig Silva:

I’ve been reading multiple things. In paper format, I found out that one of my favorite silly, scary movies was a book, and I’ve seen this movie… Oh, I’m burying the lead. It’s called The Ring. You may have heard of it.

Karen Farmer:

Oh, I have in fact heard of that.

Craig Silva:

You’ve heard of The Ring, yes. So I have loved The Ring since I was a wee lad and I’ve seen it a million times. And I love the original Ringu movie as well. The other day I watched both Back to Back because I have a problem and then I [inaudible 00:29:41] after the fact and I was like, wait, this was a book. And it’s old. So I had to go onto eBay to get this book. Came in the mail, devoured it in one day. Quite different, very different than the movie.

Karen Farmer:

Interesting.

Craig Silva:

But it’s good. It’s a very page turner book. It’s not horror, not really anyway. It’s much more history, who’d done it, thriller. There’s lots of detective work, there’s lots of tracking down leads, which is part of the movie, but the movie is much more focused on the scary bits of it. This is, I think if you were a scaredy-cat, you could read this book. There were definitely parts of it that I didn’t love. I won’t say more, but there are some-

Karen Farmer:

Triggering?

Craig Silva:

Trigger warnings, yes, for sure. Around assault and other things that I don’t think added to the story personally. I don’t think they had to be in there, but if you can get past that, it’s a good quick read, especially if you’re really into The Ring or in general. So I read that in a day, which is great. And then Eric LaRocca, got that one that you told me to read, and then I’ve picked up two since then, so I’ve been [inaudible 00:31:06].

Karen Farmer:

I am so glad I got you on the Eric LaRocca train with me. He is so talented and I just, I love-

Craig Silva:

It’s so creepy.

Karen Farmer:

I love his horror. He writes great horror.

Craig Silva:

Yeah. The other day I was walking out of my office and I saw that the Booksmith was having Eric LaRocca there that evening, and I was going to walk in and then I saw that it was sold out and I was the saddest little Eric LaRocca fan. But next time, next time. What are you reading right now?

Karen Farmer:

Oh, I am so excited to talk about this. I am reading a book that I could not be enjoying more. It is called Sucker by Daniel Hornsby. This book came out almost exactly a year ago. It was like July of 2023. So it’s still pretty new. And it is… Oh, how to describe it. It’s a satire. A modern day satire about a place that you may know of called Silicon Valley.

Craig Silva:

No. What’s that? That’s like that TV show, right?

Karen Farmer:

No. I mean, yes. And it is specifically a satire of a very well-known tech company that faced quite a great deal of litigation and I think is still facing litigation. I will not say anymore, but it is an amazing kind of speculative, satirical rendering of what was actually going on at this shady, shady company. I don’t want to say much more because I don’t want to ruin it.

Craig Silva:

But I want you to say more because I’m interested.

Karen Farmer:

The main character is really fascinating. His name is Chuck Gross, and he is the heir to a very Jeff Bezos, Elon Musk type character, like a mega-billionaire.

Craig Silva:

I can’t believe you just said those names on this podcast.

Karen Farmer:

I know. I know.

Craig Silva:

That might be the first time that the J word has ever been said on the Libro Podcast, and I am not here for it.

Karen Farmer:

Well-

Craig Silva:

I’ll blink it out in post.

Karen Farmer:

This person is not depicted in a flattering light in this book. But the main character feels really bad about who he is by default of who his father is. And he’s kind of tried to bury that for a long time. He is the founder of, I really like kind of punk rock underground record label, but he gets sucked into this weird world of Silicon Valley because of a college friend and all kinds of crazy stuff starts happening. I absolutely love it. I haven’t been able to put it down. The audiobook-

Craig Silva:

It sounds amazing.

Karen Farmer:

It’s wonderful. The audiobook is fantastic. It’s narrated by Graham Halstead, who I absolutely love. So you just really can’t go wrong with whichever way you want to read this one.

Craig Silva:

And as I say, every episode, you know where I’ll be going right after we record.

Karen Farmer:

The bookstore.

Craig Silva:

Amen.

Karen Farmer:

Our next episode, which we are so excited to share with you all is with the wonderful writer of many great horror books, Stephen Graham Jones.

Craig Silva:

Yes. I actually just finished his new book, I Was a Teenage Slasher. So good, just like every other Stephen Graham Jones book. And also, I love when he joined the call, you and I were like, “This is going to be a good one.” He had a Stephen King hat on and a scream mask behind him and horror paraphernalia. We were on the same wavelength, so-

Karen Farmer:

He had a cool office. I mean, thousands of books. I want to live in the office. It was beautiful.

Craig Silva:

Yeah, my office feels very uncool after that call, so I have some upgrades to make. So we hope you enjoyed this episode and will join us for the next one, which comes out in just a couple weeks, so…

Karen Farmer:

Awesome. Well, just as a reminder, we would love it if you could subscribe to the podcast, feel free to share it, tell a friend. We love reviews and ratings and most importantly, if you haven’t signed up for a Libro.fm membership yet, you can use the promo code SWITCH and you will get three audiobooks for your first month of membership instead of just one.

Craig Silva:

And as always, thank you for listening.